We answer several questions regarding the Hornets options with Eric Gordon, look at Anthony Davis’s rookie contract, and talk about max deals for CP3 and Deron Williams
Larry Coon does a fantastic job covering the CBA, but we understand that it is a little daunting to go through the entire thing. I see a lot of misinformation passed around by Hornets fans on some particular topics, and I figured we can have one place where we can set it all straight. With that in mind, we have collected the most common questions from Hornets fans on the new CBA, on how it specifically effects our players and/or Demps’ options. Without further adieu:
Q: Okay, can somebody just explain the amnesty to me in laymen’s terms?
A: The amnesty provision allows you to completely wipe a player’s contract off your salary cap. The owner of the team still has to pay the player, but that number will not count towards the $58 million salary cap or the $70 million luxury tax. It can be used one time per team, and it can only be used on a guy who was on the roster with his current contract before the lockout. So…
- No, the Hornets can not trade for a guy and then amnesty him.
- No, they can not sign Eric Gordon to a big contract this summer and amnesty him in the future if he keeps getting hurt
- Yes, the Hornets can still use the amnesty on one player and one player only- Jarrett Jack, who has one year on his deal at a little over 5 million. Not very likely.
Q: So, Eric Gordon is a restricted free agent this summer. In what ways does this new CBA effect him?
A: First we have to talk about his cap hold, which will be 9.6 million dollars- despite the fact that his qualifying offer is only 5.1 million. That cap hold will remain until Gordon either signs the QO, or a new contract. In the event that he signs with another team, the Hornets will have three days to match the offer. The maximum offers Gordon can get are:
- 4 Years, 55.2 million dollars from another team [12.922, 13.504, 14.085, 14.667]
- 4 Years, 57.5 million dollars from us [12.922, 13.891, 14.861, 15.830]
- 5 Years, 74.3 million dollars from us [5th year = 16.8]
His maximum salary stars off at 12.922 million for next season, and other teams can increase that salary by 4.5% every year, while the Hornets can increase it by 7.5%. Also, the Hornets are the only team that can offer him a fifth year.
Two other things to bear in mind are that Gordon did not qualify for the larger maximum salary deal for players with his number of years of NBA experience, as Derrick Rose has. Also, the maximum salary for a player depends on the salary cap as well as years under an NBA contract (regardless of playing time). The salary cap has a floor set for next season equal to the cap for last season, but the cap can increase. That information will come available in a couple of weeks. If the cap goes up 3%, the maximum salaries increase 3%, for example, since maximum salaries are a percentage of the cap. Any change in the cap will simply mean the Hornets will be slightly less affected by offering Gordon a max as long as they are willing to spend well above the cap, which most teams do. This is because the fixed deals the team have will not increase at this rate, but the effect is small.
Q: How would a sign-and-trade work with Eric Gordon if the Hornets wanted to go that route?
A: First, and foremost, this can not happen until after July 1st, so Gordon (and every other restricted FA for that matter) can not be put into any trades on draft night. After July 1st, Gordon would have to find a team and if that team wanted to offer Gordon a contract that the Hornets didn’t want to match or if Gordon told the Hornets he would just sign the QO and leave next year if not traded, then the Hornets could work out a sign and trade. If the team was a non-luxury tax team, the Hornets could take back as much as 17.9 million dollars in player salary or as little as nothing if the team had 12.922 million in cap space.
If the team they were trading him to was a luxury tax team, the Hornets would have to take back between 10.3 and 16.5 million dollars in salary. Also, if another team does sign Gordon to an offer sheet and the Hornets match, the Hornets can not ever trade Gordon to the team he signed the sheet with, and if they want to trade Gordon in the next year, he must approve the trade.
Q: Since Gordon gets injured all the time, can the Hornets give him a lower base salary with performance (games played) bonuses?
A: The Hornets can not put an incentive bonus for number of games played per the CBA, but they can be creative and give performance bonuses that can have the same effect. They can structure the contract so that up to 15% of it is earned by reaching certain benchmarks, but games played can not be one of those benchmarks since teams have sat players in the past so they would not reach that benchmark.
Q: What if the Hornets wanted to go after Deron Williams this year or CP3 next year? How much cap room would we need to have to give them a max contract?
A: The max salary for either of those players will start at 105% of their previous years salary. For Deron Williams, that would mean 17.2 million. Chris Paul’s would start a little higher, meaning the Hornets would have to get 18.7 million under next year to throw a max deal at him. Compare that to restricted guys coming off of rookie deals like Serge Ibaka and James Harden, who would only count for 12.922 million their first year.
Q: What will Anthony Davis’s salary look like over the course of his rookie contract?
A: Assuming the Hornets start him off at 120% of the scale, these are his cap numbers:
- 2012-13: 5,144,280
- 2013-14: 5,375,760
- 2014-15: 5,607,240
- 2015-16: 7,065,123
- 2016-17: 9,184,660 Qualifying offer; 17.6 million dollar cap hold
Throw Questions at us in the comments section and we will make sure to address them in Part Two of this series.
76 responses to “Hornets CBA FAQ Part One: Eric Gordon, Anthony Davis, and CP3”
Great Work with Really good info!
#GoodRead
Looks like Cleveland will get Barnes or MKG, so as I have been saying all along- watch out for the Cavs. They can throw the max at him, and afford to wait the three days because there are no other must have targets for them.
Indy won’t do it, but I do anticipate they call and ask if Hornets would do a sign and trade for a Collison/Granger combo- which Hornets will say no to.
If the Nets lose D-Will to Dallas, Gordon could become their primary target.
Philly might call about a sign and trade and can even offer him max if they amnesty Brand and renounce their bird rights to Lou Williams
Minnesota could offer him the max if they renounce rights to Beasley. Rubio, Gordon, Derrick Williams, and Love? Kinda scary.
That’s about it for the teams that Gordon would consider. If I had to guess, I think Cleveland throws a max or near max at Gordon, expecting Hornets to match, but will be happy if they don’t.
My offer? I go to Gordon and say, “Here’s 5 years, 55 million. A flat 11 per season, but the last two years are player options. If you stay healthy, you can rip those last two years up and get a max deal from us, which will be in the neighborhood of 5 years, 95 million based on your tenure at that point.”
Gordon is guaranteed 55 million in that scenario, even if gets hurt every year, but if he thrives and stays injury free, he gets paid 128 million over the next 8 years.
Think 5 @ 55 is below what was offered prior to deadline last year.
(thought I remembered it being for 12 per)
Think 5 for 65 is nice offer. Think we cam agree ej is worth 13 now and hopefully should b a big time bargain 4 years later
As a cavs fan, the only free agent signings our organization is looking toward, would be veterans on short deals. they’re not interested in building outside the draft from everything I’ve read.
Which teams are most likely to throw near-max or max money to EG10?
I think you will find teams who have some cap space. I think Boston, Houston, Indiana and Charlotte would all look at the option of a max contract for EG
Next year when Chris Paul becomes a free agent, while I understand he is unrestricted, will the clippers have a window where they can offer him a contract before free agency starts like the NFL does. Thanks
they have bird rights on paul, so he can get more money from LA than we would be able to throw at him in FA… that could be a difference maker for him.. to be honest, I doubt he’d sign with us… I think he’d be happier getting the max in LA than gettin a 4-year deal back in the big easy… and yes, the floppers can offer him a new contract prior to us (which means he can already have signed a new contract with them by the tima FA kicks in for us)
please, correct me if I’m mistaken, here in Brazil it’s tough to get quality info about the new CBA and especially about our Hornets!!! and kudos to your work michael and everyone else (mason, ryan, etc..), many brazilian fans get updates here about the hornets! keep up the great work you’ve been doing!!
Can we do what the Heat did and sign our big 3 to less-than-max contacts? (CP3, DH12, EG10)
Lol. Not those big three
EG10, AD23, JS14!
The Hornets could clear all their contracts and just have SkyNet, the 10th pick, Eric Gordon, Ayon, and J-Smitty on the roster at the start of next summer. Let’s suppose that EG gets his max under this scenario as well. That brings the Hornets to 25 million. Factor in cap holds and they would have 28 million dollars in cap room under that scenario.
CP3 and Dwight would have to take a paycut of about 25 million each over 4 years in that scenario. Not happening. LeBron and D-Wade took a pay cut of about 1/4 of that.
But the Hornets could offer one of those guys (or Bynum) the max and either retain some of their young guys (Aminu, Vasquez, Henry, 2013 1st rounder) or go and get another vet for about 9 million per. Think CP3 and Nikola Petrovic starting next to Gordon, Aminu, and Davis with Rivers, Smitty, and Ayone as your bench!
Or, they will have enough to throw max deals at 2 guys coming off of rookie contracts like: Harden, Ibaka, Steph Curry, Jennings, Ty Lawson, Jrue Holiday. Or have enough to go the veteran route and possibly get two to three of the following: Milsap, Josh Smith, Al Jefferson, Manu Ginobli, Kevin Martin, Iggy, Ellis, Devin Harris, Calderon
Insane amount of options.
You also have to account for where they took the pay cut – in florida w/ no state taxes.
Thanks.
Great article
Sweet, looks like you guys don’t get an offseason this year!
I’ve been looking forward to this offseason all throughout the regular season, which isn’t usually a good thing, but I guess we can make an exception for SkyNet…
Great job Michael!
What are the qualifications to be a bird player and what does it mean for the hornets if we try to sign one of these bird players
there you go : http://basketball.about.com/od/collegebasketballglossary/g/bird-rights.htm
if the hornets try to sign a restricted FA, the team that holds his bird rights has 3 days to match our offer sheet and keep him under the same circumstances we’d have signed him..
when we offer a player an offer sheet, that “contract” counts against our cap untill the player decides to sign with us, to pick his offer sheet(if he’s offered one by his team) or his team matches the offer… I guess that’s it
I think people are over looking Portland as a potential player for Gordon. They had a ton of expiring contracts this year and will need to build around LaMarcus. LA/EG would be a great 1 2 punch for them. And they have the insanely rich owner to pay for a winning squad.
And we have a billionaire owner
Who has a history of being cheap. While they have a guy who’s top 5 in the world in wealth.
My comment wasn’t to make a Benson vs. Allen discussion. Just adding another team with the cap space and most likely desire to throw a max deal Gordon’s way.
Benson doesn’t have a history of being cheap. Stop that. Just because you don’t want the Hornets to keep Gordon. Stop that. LOL.
Is that your Stephen A. Smith impersonation QueenBee? Haha
He actually does have a history of being cheap. Guy wanted to move the Saints to San Antonio and lives in Texas. Don’t get some crazy idea that he is the savior of New Orleans. No class.
Some of you either aren’t Saints fans, didn’t do much reading about Benson in the past, or have short/selective memories. Benson was very cheap at times with the Saints. Not to say it’s a given Benson will low ball this team but likes not act like he’s been Mr. Wonderful his whole times as the owner.
A Benson series is in the works. Talk it up now, but just know the opportunity will arise. Right not, the focus is elsewhere.
We are going to cover it all.
Yeah, very true. Im really looking for dell demps to put a foot in Benson’s a**, tell him what the team really needs, then the 80 year old owner will foot the bill. Oh and make no mistake, David stern is our savior. Kept us in nola for two years with plenty of cities such as Seattle and believe it or not Birmingham trying to get us away from nola. Oh and also, in hindsight, the cp3 trade was perfect. Got the best up and coming shooting guard in the league and a guy who I think can develop into a high quality small forward in aminu. If we would’ve went with lakers, yes we would’ve gotten the likes of dragic and scola but we also would’ve ended up with a crazy Lamar odom. I really like where we are right now. Benson’s got the cash. Demps will make him spend it.
Once again Lil Throne you’re clueless and flapping your mouth with the wrong info! Tom Benson was never cheap as the Saints owner. The only thing that Tom Benson was quilty of was being clueless about running a football team. Tom Benson put all of his trust in Jim Finks, who ran the Saints whole operations from top to bottom. Jim Finks was very old school in his beliefs of paying players the salaries that were rising in the free agency era! Jim Finks was the reason for the loses of Hebert, Morton Anderson, and other ugly contract signing hold outs/cuts in Saints history! The only thing Benson did was supply the money. Tom Benson did even know why the offense practiced in white and the defense practice in a different color of black, causing Tom Benson to start fussing at his first day of practice as the New Owner, saying he wanted the team to be all in one color! AGAIN, Tom Benson never made a decision on paying his players, it was Jim Finks! As for now, Today in 2012 Tom Benson has learned a lot and he is more envolved with the Saints as a owner than in the 80-90’s, Benson still allows his team of front office personal of Rita, Loomis and others run the team with daily updated with him Dailey, having the Saints ranked in the Top 10 as the highest paid/salary cap team in 2000! Before The Sean Payton era(Top 5), Tom Benson paid his players with big contracts, unfortunately with the silliness on Ditka/Kuharich and Haslett, those clowns just paid the wrong people those big contracts!
*Get your info correct joker and stop babbling false-truths!
FYI
After Jim Finks, the Saints have been in the upper half as the highest paid in the NFL! *We just paid the wrong players*
I read story’s of guys ice bathing in garbage cans and other things. If that’s not being cheap not sure what is.
What you read was a reflection of a his growth from being a clueless owner to one of the NFL’s Best. The Saints didn’t have a training facility dude! Their old training grouds were near LP&L’s Field of electrical power lines on David Drive, where they lifted weights in metal trailors! Yes, it was a disgrace for any Professional Franchise but it was a slap in the face to Louisiana bcuz EVERTHING was tide down to the state under corrupt politics. Until in recent years Tom Benson has started to seperate himself from the traditional way of doing things here in the State Of Louisiana, by trying to get the governments hands off of the Professional Teams operations here in the state. And citizens here in Louisiana fussed a bout Benson wanting to own his own stock/lease in the teams facilities.
*Dude get your facts straight before you speak of Louisiana Topics/anything in life. Until then, shut up Please!
#FalseTruths
Almost forgot who I was dealing with.
All make sure I only engage with people who are on my level from a maturity stand point.
Even though deron expressed this morning that his top two choices were Dallas and new Jersey. Does anyone think with our aggressive gm and massive cap space, that we could still get him?
Brooklyn sorry
I am afraid to say “No chance at D-Will” because Ryan and I said that in the podcast, and a reader almost had a meltdown. Called us too mature and rational!
Michael, no worries on that haha. Deron is 99.9% chance of going to either Brooklyn or Dallas. But just keeping a little hope. I’m a patient fan, but I definitely wouldn’t mind a run at a championship this year. Haha. Here is my realistic line up for next season, tell me what you think: PG: jack
SG: Gordon
SF: Aminu
PF: Davis
C: McGee. I really see us going after someone like lillard to learn from jack and play somewhat of a sixth man role. Then go after JaVale McGee in the free agency. But in a perfect world, I see us drafting Tyler Seller for center and then getting d-will to come on down to nola.
NOOOO!!!! Not McGee. Please. Spare us all. He hasn’t figured it out yet. Yes, he’s got talent, and hustle; but he’s got little-to-no basketball IQ. Why not Hibbert or Brook Lopez? Just not McGee. And besides, all these guys are RFA’s. Their teams expect them to be future stars so they probably won’t just let them walk away without a fight. I bet if these guys leave, they’re extremely overpaid.
Why is no one mentioning Roy Hibbert as someone the Hornets should go after? If we sign Dragic or Sessions at PG and Hibbert at C, I see a starting five that is difficult to match up with.
And, to add to my comment, I don’t want CP3 back. He’s already proven that his allegiance is with his ego and his pocket book, not with his team mates. Also, when is the last time a great PG won a championship? Hibbbert would anchor us in the middle (along with a versatile Anthony Davis at PF), signing Dragic would give us dishes, 3’s and defense at PG (w/o trying to be the “star”), signing Gordon will give us our scoring, and drafting Perry Jones III would give us that tall athletic SF we’d need to create mismatches. Do that, and we’ll be teaching Benson boogie lessons.
Because Indy wants badly to keep Hibbert?
Skynet? That sounds silly. I hope that crap doesn’t catch on.
Skynet! What is it? Defense network, terminator, destroyer of mankind?
Why don’t we just call the kid with his name? Anthony Davis!
Why are we trying to impose a nickname to AD anyways? Just to be able to replace unibrow? 🙂 Stop using unibrow and that’s it. Let him earn a nickname with his play in the NBA!
Maybe he will be more than defense and he will earn something more than Skynet!? Who knows?
Some UK fans called him Spiderman! How about that??
I like spidy
General question about the Amnesty clause that doesn’t apply to the Hornets anymore, but I couldn’t quite understand from Larry Coon’s FAQ (probably need it dumbed down a little):
Player has 2 years, 20 million @ 10 mil per year, fully guaranteed remaining on contract. Team amnesties him. No waiver claim is put on him by any team. Does the team owe him $10 mil (the upcoming year’s salary) or $20 mil (total remaining on the contract)?
Team owes him everything.
Also, for the readers generally, we can amnesty Jack and only Jack, and only this contract. If he re-ups, that contract can’t be amnestied.
Also, out of curiosity, not saying we would but could the Hornets and Pacers work out a dual sign-and-trade of Gordon for Hibbert? Or, if that’s not allowed, is it against league rules to make a “covert” agreement that the Hornets sign Hibbert and the Pacers sign Gordon, and the other team doesn’t match for either one? That’s probably colluding to keep salaries lower, right?
Why on Earth would the Hornets give up Gordon for Hibbert when we have the cap room to have both? Also, if we give up Gordon, who will score points for us? Belineli? lol. Sign and trade Gordon for Danny Granger is a much more promising deal. Never give up your only scorer for a post man.
Question- what are the penalties for going over the cap limit? Going over the luxury limit? Seems like the teams that win swallow the extra price tag to get there(ie heat lakers celtics macs etc.) also how likely is it that our small market team spends 60 or 65 million to add that extra difference maker?
That will come shortly, I’m sure.
The short is:
The penalties for exceeding the cap is more procedural. Certain kinds of flexibility in terms of acquiring players is replaced by a less flexibly set of methods. For example, rather than just tossing a check to a player to attract them, you have work withing a set of cap exceptions (the exceptions are why it’s a soft cap).
The penalities for exceed the tax are procedural and financial. The exceptions are reduced compared to a team that is only over the cap instead of both the cap and the tax, and the team has to pay money into a pool for a certain kind of revenue sharing for certain other teams. The rules for this are written down, complex, but are being phased in, coming in to full effect next offseason.
Thanks! Looking forward to the article. Maybe in the new article you can also answer whether there are different penalties/rules for teams that are already locked up for $75mil like the heat before the new cba was in place. I’m kind of a geek and love reading about the ins and outs of the cba. 🙂
You want, you got it.
Mike, make it happen!
(It’s very easy when I get to just sign Mike up to write stuff.)
Just a guess here, but I would think that the new CBA gave teams 2 years to make the adjustments and if they can’t then they are hit.
Anyone else notice that article on dell demps at the coffee shop with the guys twitter isn’t there anymore. Also if you go to his twitter, @betterhlf, his tweets are protected so you can’t see them. I guess someone high up on the hornets saw it and demanded it be removed. Dang maybe I should be a reporter on this site. How does that sound mike?
I noticed.
Does this mean I get a job offer?
Jobs include pay. This is a job for no one.
If you are interested in writing, I suggest you contact the editover via the @Hornets247 twitter and submit some samples. When we make changes, and we regularly do, that will be one source of looking for writers.
And can josh be my assistant
Thanks
I never knew y’all didnt get paid. Well you all do a very good job. I got fed up waiting for espn to write an article on the hornets before my friend recommended this site. And y’all are much more knowledgeable about the hornets than the paid so call experts
I’m glad you took my reply as serious. I know you two are horsing around, but, yeah, I get paid my job. I do this because I care and I like it sometimes. At first I was just interseted in learning more about current events, got to doing the news, then got into the ownership and labor stuff, kind of becoming the expert in all that and other boring stuff (in case you haven’t noticed).
The main things is want to and to be able write to pieces at least weekly when necessary (daily in my case for over a year) with absolutely no compensation other than knowing you are doing a good thing.
It takes a certain mix of talent and stupidity. The question is, are you that stupid?
And thanks to you. Nice to read / hear / whatever. We try to be the tops, especially in areas where other places are lacking. It’s easy to get box scores, etc. from other sites. We try to bring in stuff that just won’t make it in the paper (my articles would almost never be published in a paper, at least in the form they appear here). Same of more mass-market consumerism.
We’re a place for those Hornets super-consumers, a term I’ve appropriated recently in talks about the site.
jason, there are many foreign hornets fans, and i’d like to write for hornets247, maybe telling how we feel and see things away from the big easy… there’s also a blog about the hornets here in Brazil , brazilianhornet.wordpress.com…. any chance?
There’s always a chance. See the instructions above about submitting samples.
We will not be looking at all until the season draws near, if then.
And yes, your blog is one to read and should be on the list I had above. I will add it.
the blog isn’t mine, even tough I have already written a few pieces to them… but thanks anyway for reading it! we discuss about the hornets in a daily basis! I’ll follow the instructions!
Hey, I’m the one that texted you those two things. I think that you should give me some credit.
My sources included josh
Hey, I know that this website and the affiliate (hornetsreport) and atthehive are good. Is there any other good Hornets website?
I read both of those. As far as forums go, I look at Hornets Talk at Tiger Droppings. I also look at the nola sports krewe. They have a very local take on things, and that is their purpose. It’s a little more serious of an affair.
I read Everett’s occasional post at http://hornetswisdom.blogspot.com/
http://hornetshype.com/wp/ is a place to see random posts of varying pitch very occasionally. They vary from well-thought-out legal posts to editorials. The frequency has dropped.
Bee Ball Blog seems to be no more.
Then their is Jim Eichenhofer’s blog. He has good access, but he has a number of duties with the team, so the frequency is low. He has good access and is a good writer. http://neworleanshornetsblog.blogspot.com/
Then there are the local news outlets, TP included, all the tv stations, nola sports, etc.
If someone knows more, as I may have forgotten some, let me know. I think the above are the only Hornets dedicated one.
If you have want to see a piece about something, drop a note in the comments and we may be able to accommodate.
At the Hive is the best of the places listed for analysis. Jim for access.
One I forgot. brazilianhornet.wordpress.com is in Portuguese. Google translate can be used to translate entire webpages, which is how I read it.
Thanks a bunch!!!
Swarm&sting is other, i think it was an australian guy, havent check it in a while.
Those two guys . . . write here.
Edit: looks like they are up again with new guys. Way to go, fan-sided.
Great article (again). Also thanks for the other site-recommendations. I just love my hornets stuff.
As I see it, it would be most prudent to wait what other team offer Gordon and than just match it, right? That way there is a minimal chance we overpay him too much.
I am in favor of keeping him next to Davis as a great pick’n roll / pop partner. Offensively and defensively they could be great (fingers crossed EG doesnt hurt another part of his body).
What are realistic center possibilities out there? Do we wait for Ibaka next year?
@ Throne
It’s amazing how EJ isn’t good/healthy enough to sign with the Hornets but it would be Great for him to sign with Portland to form a “Great 1-2 Punch” with LaMarcus Aldridge in Rip City! You have found every reason on earth why the Hornets shouldn’t resign him, even questioning his talents by saying IYO he’s not a Top 25 NBA talent. But he’s elite enough to form a “Great” tandom in another city/franchise!? Lmao…..
#Fake
You are so wrong I do know where to start. I’ve never once questioned his potential to be a special player never. What has been my stance is we shouldn’t give him anything near max dollars for several reasons. The main one being his health issues.
Just because I don’t think he’s a top 25 player right now has no bearing on where I’ll have him ranked by the end of next year or by no means is it me saying he can’t get there(not that he’s far off IMO anyways).
As far as finding reasons I’ve had the same 3 reasons since the question has been posed what to do with EJ.
Once again for an individual that holds himself in such high regards you seriously struggle to comperhend much of anything. Love, like, dislike or hate my opinions. I’m consistent and I’ll admit when I’m wrong. Grow up person.
Q: Would Justin Hamilton from LSU be a Good pick at 46 if we get a guard/wing at 10? My Thoughts He can rebound, block shots, decent mid-range game and has an NBA body. The LSU part may make him a fan favorite I kind of see him as a spencer hawes. But I do go to LSU so maybe I’m bias.
[…] years. He’s widely expected to be seeking a near-max deal this summer. According to our Hornets CBA FAQ, there are three he could potentially […]
[…] provided the basis of our CBA FAQ Part One, CBA FAQ Part Two, and CBA FAQ Part Three, and likely any future […]