I agree that Dell has shown a tendency to target "young vets," but I feel part of that, like getting Ariza, could have been a semi-panic move in an attempt to field a team good enough to convince CP3 to stay. It forced him to think short term over long term in a sense. Hopefully with a sort of clean slate, he gives himself some flexibility. I'd like to see a year of Davis and a healthy (hopefully) Gordon before making any long term decisions, especially when next year's FA class looks so promising. Great podcast guys
In the NO Podcast Episode 72: Farewell to OkAriza
Michael and I talk about the big trade that sent Okafor and Ariza to the Wizards and what it means for the Hornets, short and long term, and if it impacts their draft at all.
Exciting times in the NO.
Enjoy the Podcast! Want it on Itunes?
any chance we trade #10 for #21 and #22? maybe draft tony wroten and royce white? from the looks of things, there will def be good players available there...
Hornets get: Brandon Jennings Drew Gooden Bucks get: 10th Pick Al-Farouq Aminu Greivis Vasquez We get out PG of the future! We know he can play! Bucks add more young guys to build around Ellis and now have two lottery picks!
With Kaman & Landry gone, I posted we needed bigs, not Rivers or MKG. With Okafor, Kaman, and Landry gone, I can't see us drafting guards or small forwards. They are easier to find in free agency anyway.
Honestly, I hate how you guys are downplaying the huge potential upside of this move. Saying that we have 0% chance at Deron Williams is ridiculous and shows that you pay no attention to the history of Benson's aggressive moves, etc. I think you are soft-peddling it because it seems like the "mature" and "rational" thing to do, like all of us who see this potential are childlike dreamers. This is not the George Shinn Hornets. You are going to be surprised and will have egg on your face when we go after Deron Williams aggressively. The thing that really irks me is that less than a week ago you made a post about not throwing away your CP3 jerseys.... well, why is Deron Williams less realistic than CP3? He's healthier, better, less of a prima donna, and he's available RIGHT NOW! Your logic makes no sense and is actually somewhat maddening. But that's fine, you can continue to play the "mature, rational" card. I hope it blows up in your face.
You hope what blows up? Why does someone with a different reaction bother you? I didn't get downplaying the upside from them so much as Mike has been seeing it and that this didn't affect that. In fact, I think talking to Ryan and others softened Mike, in fact. What additional upside do we have here in your mind?
Dude..... Remember when Derron Williams demanded a trade to the Nets because eh wanted a big market and was in "win now" mode? I would ask you when DWill made the paradigm shift to the complete polar opposite of this? We have a lot to prove before we're seen as a desirable free agent destination. When was the last time a top 3 player in his position went to a small market "rebuilding team" (Demps' words as of yesterday) where he had no history? The speculation of Dwight and DWill are pipe dreams for Hornets fans but they aren't based in reality. Buying into that is exactly what the propagators of the WWE version of the NBA would prefer you to believe.
We have mentioned CP3 and Harden in multiple articles and podcasts already and have said are both very realistic. D-Will is zero percent. If I wrote for a Christmas blog, I would not discuss Santa Claus as if he were fact- I have an obligation to be objective. Whether you choose to believe in Santa or not is up to you.
You guys post a special post-trade 30 minute podcast and don't even give a MENTION to the potential of us going after big ticket free agents either now (Deron Williams) or next off season (Harden, CP3, etc) as a result of this trade. Hollinger, CBS, SI, ESPN, etc. all mention how this makes us players yet our own fan site poo poos the idea, seemingly writing it off as "pie in the sky".
I don't remember saying anything about "mature" or "rational". But let's discard any pretense to either. 0% chance, stupidface. Neener Neener Neener.
Not sure about all the stuff about who you can do it to, but the signing bonus can be paid early and affect your cap in one of two ways: yearly, so it's like salary, or all in the first year but you can only do that up to the cap. You have to be actually under the cap to do it.
Here's a great way to find a realistic trade grade. How disappointed on a scale of 1-10 would you be if Okafor failed his physical and the trade got rescinded? 9-10 range for me personally.
I'd rather Smith starting at the 5 over Okafor and letting Davis roam the paint and Aminu starting at the 3 and continuing to develop into a much better player than Ariza. Why would you want Okafor and Ariza around for 1 more year just to amnesty him next year? No one who's worth a crap in the NBA doesn't want those 2. Why should we? You know who wants those 2? The 2nd crappiest team in the NBA.
DRUMMOND will fall to our 10th pick....AD,ROBINSON,MKG,BEAL,BARNES are the likely top 5....blazers they really like lillard at 6...GS nid a SF,TOR?they already have valanciunas coming...the pistons are the real threat here...wil they go leonard,henson,zeller or drummond if his still available...if they draft one of the 1st three i mention first then we can snatch AD at 10...2 AD in hornets is damn good....^^,...satoransky and machado really are intriguing prospect at 46
From what I hear the Pistons are really high on Henson thinking that they can pair his defense with Monroe's offense for their frontcourt.
As much as I hope he does, I just can't foresee that happening. Should mention that also I wouldn't hate it Demps signed Hibbert to a max deal, he works his ass off, improves every year and will definitely be a favourite with Monty. Played pretty well in the playoffs this year as well. I'd much rather sign him to the max then Ibaka.
Also, as far as giving grades for this trade. I agree it may be in the B- range if you are grading the overall perspective of the franchise. I think differently. It is obvious that Benson did not want to use the amnesty clause and probably told Dell to go about this in a different direction. I prefer to give "grades' to general managers and what they have to work with. So I am going to assume that Dell did not have the option to use the amnesty clause. Therefore, I will give Dell an A- for this trade since he didn't have to give any other valuable assets to unload Ariza and Okafor. I can't envision a better trade for Dell's perspective. Solid A- for Dell.
We also have to keep in mind that Monty and Dell don't have the greatest job security under Benson. It didn't take long for Hugh Weber to get the axe. It would be beneficial for Monty and Dell to make short sighted moves in order to win now in order to keep their jobs and get a new contract. Unfortunately, that short sightedness would hurt the franchise in the long-run. Just something to think about.
Monty has mentioned recently about adding length and he brought up the Lakers having two 7 footers in their starting lineup. So he may have in mind of building a twin towers scenerio to make it impossible for opponents to score on us. Omer Asik still intrigues me as a possible option to put next to Davis. Of course, if we went this route, we would have to find a more reliable scorer to replace Aminu in the starting lineup.
That is a great point. With Aminu and Davis we would definitely need some scoring from the Center position to help us. Also don't forget that Perry Jones the 3rd came in on Monday with Sullinger and Skynet. I'm not saying that I'd necessarily want him at 10 but maybe Monty and Demps fell in love. We shall see....
*Correction, the Blazers have the 6th pick as well. I have also seen mocks where Detroit is looking at Leonard at #9. My point is it wouldn't be a reach to pick Leonard at #10.
It's not a reach to take Myers Leonard at 10. The Blazers are thinking about him with either the 8 or the 11th pick. Ryan, if we draft Leonard and he grows into a solid starter I expect a full article apology saying that you were wrong LOL! And Micheal please stop with your love of Millsap for the 10th pick. That would be horrible. And I know you're gonna say how "There are no positions and Skynet can easily be a 5" but no. Let's just let Skynet be the Power Forward he was destined to be. Why build a foundation with flaws that can't be fixed?
Okay, but please don't be disappointed if he is a Hornet next week. If you think I love him, I don't know what you would call how Monty and Dell feel about him. If Jazz really are willing to deal him, he has just as good of a chance at becoming a Hornet on June 28th as any of these prospects in the 10th pick tourney, Don't kill the messenger. Zombian- Outside of whether or not you agree with me and think Millsap is a great fit, he is a FANASTIC player. 5th highest PER amongst power forwards- the most stacked position in the NBA. And honestly, there is not one thing he doesn't do very well. Can score in the post, on the perimeter, and off of putbacks. In fact, in 2010-11, he hit 52% of his shots from 10-15 feet (#1 in the entire league). Hits his free throws, is a very good passer for a big, and averaged nearly 2 steals a game last year. Top it off with the exact attitude that Monty wants this team to have, and there literally is not another guy in the league who fits the prototype of what Dell and Monty want. The guy is a star, as far as his level of play, yet he is more than willing to be a 6th man in a small market if asked, and you never hear a peep from him. You might find more potential at ten, but there is no way you find anything close to his production
I agree that Millsap is a good player right now and I get your point about how he does the dirty work but I think for long term success it would be better if we say re-signed Kaman, who could make up for Skynet's probable offensive struggles during his first few years, and let Leonard develop behind him off the bench. I also wouldn't be mad if we drafted Lillard or Marshall with the pick.
Ok, so if the inescapable conclusion is that the Hornets could have come to the same end point as in this trade, maybe while saving a few dollars, but only a year later, what does that tell you? That the Hornets believe there is an advantage to getting to this point prior to the 2012 Draft and Free Agency period, rather than arriving at this point just prior to the 2013 Draft and Free Agency period. So what are these advantages? In the Draft, it's you now have holes at PG, C and SF too. PG was the most glaring need pre-trade that you had to address via a draft pick or trading the pick. Now you can take the best player available, likely a C or a PF, at 10 if you keep it. It also means you can trade the pick for a C, PF, or SF that you like long-term, rather than just say a PG. Also, there must be players available in 2012 Free Agency that the Hornets want who can play C, SF, or PG. They can try to land one now, too. I don't see us having Aminu at SF or Smith/Ayon at C to start the season. So veteran players will be coming to the Hornets from somewhere.
I think the whole Hornets community is with you on last season and wanting to win. But I ask again, "What that has to do with who starts?". James Harden is clearly better than Sefolosha but guess who starts the games? It doesn't matter who is on the court at tipoff. Whose on the court on crunch-time is much more important to me.
it matters a lot to me. one year of heavy duty losing was more than enough for me. forget the lottery next year, it's time to start building a winning culture
Haaa! Kostas Papanikolaou! It's funny hearing you mis-pronounce soo many player's names, but I'm greek so this one is really funny! I want him!