The Bulls beat the Hornets
It’s not often that you canÂ have 17 more free throws and 10 less turnovers than an opponent and lose, but tonight the Hornets did that.Â The Hornets took a double-digit lead into halftime – but it was a dangerous double-digit lead because the Hornets had been hittingÂ most ofÂ their jumpers in the first half.Â That rarely continues throughout a game, and it didn’t tonight.
Of course, the biggest problem there wasn’t just that the Hornets started missing their jumpers in the second half – they couldn’t get a rebound all game long.Â They were out-reboundedÂ 47-26 in that game.Â The starting line-up managed to grab 12 total rebounds all game long.Â 12.Â Â 2 each from David West and Trevor Ariza.Â It’s hard to continue to be a great defensive team when you don’t box out and your big men aren’t able to contest shots.Â OhÂ – and the 18th ranked offense in the league shot 52% FG, 46% 3Pt, and 96% FTÂ for that game.Â Â For perspective, if a player is shooting 50%, 40% and 90%, they are considered one of the premier shooters ever.Â They shot that way as a team.Â Ugh.
In fact, there was one lone bright-spot in the game, and that was the guy we don’t even expect to play half the time:Â
Marcus had the explosive game he has every so often, scoring inside and out, and pretty much keeping the Hornets in it.Â Â
Marcus had a tough opening, missing two shots and getting burned on a defensive rotation.Â But he stuck through it and his shot started to fall, and he and JackÂ ended with combining toÂ outscore the Bulls bench between them.Â It’s just fun to see him wreaking havoc.Â (That cut off the inbounds play for the layup?Â Beautiful)
Here’s some quick observations from early in the game:
- Monty had Aaron Gray posting Boozer to start the game, and it worked nicely.Â Boozer just wasn’t big enough.
- West had his shot going all game – but the Bulls denied him from receiving the ball better than anyone I’d seen in a while.Â They kept shading their guards and forwards his way and made it hard to squeeze the ball into him.Â Particularly in the second half.
- Andersen was terrible in the first half.Â For most of the time out there, he just couldn’t handle Boozer, and when a rebound was available, he couldn’t hold position at all.Â He also wasn’t hitting his shots – so it made for a very ugly game for him.
I’d like to keep going, but I’m tired of recapping losses.
I swear Joe Gerrity has a voodoo curse on me.Â Maybe I should stop being a Hornets blogger.Â They’d never lose again.
I hope there aren't any more questions about who the best PG is. I really like Paul, and there's no shame in being second best.
Seriously..People have problems on Here..The loss had nothing to do with rotations..We Missed 13 Free Throws!!!..That's it!..When the game was tied down the stretch we shouldve been up at least 8..We're Overacheiving this year and yet no1 seems satisfied..If Marcus doesn't get his shot blocked Brewer(no blame on Marcus just great D by a great defender) on that fast break that led to a Watson 3 We win this game..And that's with the missed free throws..We have a damn good team People..And I know for a fact teams Dont wanna see Us come Playoff Time.......Hornets All Day Bitches!!
Not sure why everyone is flipping out about a loss. Chicago is one of the top teams in the East, and the NBA. Hornets are going to lose some games. It's been a weird year and New Orleans has been up and down all season.
@bgalella Hornets had a chance to win, but shot themselves in the foot at the free throw line. Separately, there's a minority of Hornet fans who hate to see Derrick Rose excel.
well when you leave all those free throws on the table, collapse in the fourth, and so on you can tend to get frustrated. Ik I was infuriated.
Add me to the list of those sick of insulting and extreme emotionaly posts. When your chief argument is that your point is obvious, then there is no need for the rhetoric. It is becoming obvious that Thornton is our 2nd most productive guard, behind CP3, as measured by my favorite metric (Wins Produced). He is slightly below average, while Green, Jack, and Belinelli are all WAY below average. However, that metric still can't capture defense effectively, so Green and Belly may get a bit more PT than they apparently deserve due to that. Also, Marcus may be getting more play versus back-up which might inflate his numbers a bit. I also don't know how that would look if you just analyzed road games. Marcus does generally suck on the road, except for that game last year in Cleveland. I would still give him more PT, but recognize that we have to try to develop other players and combinations as well. We will need a second 2-guard come play-off time. Anyway, on to the other 11 players... I hate small ball, especially with a line-up of Thornton, Green, and Jack. The rebounding discrepancy was mostly due to lack of PT for Gray, but West and all other bigs were ineffective tonight. Jack hogged the ball for almost every possession he had. Zero passes. Green and Thorton didn't pass much either. In fact, nobody passed into the post or in the paint the entire second half. May be great defense, but I suspect it was fatigue and overconfidence in the jump shot. West was very passive in the 2nd half. He did not drive to the basket or take many shots when he did get the ball. The free throw mess was painful to watch, because we all knew it would cost us the game after the 5th or 6th missed one. CP3 is spending too much time working the corners and sidelines, and not enough attacking the middle of the paint. When he attacks the middle we get straight-on looks for 3s (ball comes from the direction of the basket, not the side) and shorter range pops for West. Gray's game has improved dramatically. In general, he is hanging on to the ball in traffic much better. Still had a horrible turnover or two, but not as bad as earlier in the year.
Can somebody tell me the play that is ran when Green, Jack and Thorton are in the lineup? The one where they are near half court and pass the ball to the other guard who runs to the middle and passes the ball to the other guard and runs to the middle. They run it all the time and I don't think it creates good shots or much scoring.
I don't know what it is about those 3 together but it is easily the biggest ballhog lineup we have. They take turns killing ball movement. If they aren't killing ball movement they are doing their silly dribble handoffs at the top of the key that facilitate nothing worth mentioning.
Boozer = good. Rose = overrated. To clarify, my prior use of the term "horrible" was somewhat exaggerated frustration. They are not Cavaliers-horrible, they are more like Hornets two years ago horrible. Like wait for this team to get blown out in the playoffs horrible. In the East. Bulls did not impress me. At no point in this game did I feel like the Bulls were a better team. More than anything, I felt the mixture of our failure to execute on offense down the stretch and bad officiating ended this game. But, shout out to the home crowd, who did their best to motivate the team, and were real loud. Especially booing out the losers who kept trying to chant "MVP" for Rose. Not in my Arena.
Something encouraging: several tables at dinner were talking about the game and people struck up a conversation with me after about it (the free throw shooting, they wouldn't hear rebounding). Attendance aside, the Hornets are growing their share in the people's chatter.
ya...rebounding. This is the silent killer for me here. I think when you don't drive to the basket, as Rose loves to do, you don't get the foul calls. And when you get comphy with outside shots, and they miss, the rebounds had better be there. There were no offensive rebounds off missed long shots last night.
Relax.... They had some raging shots from Roase that 4th. Not sure, but he was the reason for their fantastic percentage at the line. Well, ya...they all did well, but how often will a team shoot 100 percent from the line? More concerned with our reboundings. Thought Gray played a silent but extremely effective inside game. Just cannot pin point the lack of rebounds without going through the stats. To me, they seemed to get a lot of rebounds off our missed jumpers. When our jump shots stopped, I do't thin we forced the ball inside like they did. We should have beaten this team. And I think Paul was out-played lst night. He didn't dive in for shots and rose did.
Paul, I agree. Rose took over, made some crazy shots, and won that game. Chris was pretty much ineffectual last night, at least compared to Rose. He tried to make some stuff happen down the stretch, but it just didn't go. The execution wasn't there. I'm not saying Chris is done by any means, but last night it was glaringly obvious to me that Rose was the better point guard. Sadly, that's the first time I've ever thought Chris wasn't the best point guard on the court.
No, I will never say Rose is a better point guard. I think Paul actually is, just because he sets up others way, way better. Rose, I think...sets himself up better by being able to create shots. I think J Jack is kind of more Rose(ish) than a Paul. I would take a Paul over a Rose...as long as I had the options to pass to. What good is a great set up guy without the personnel to set up. And again, I need to say I do not know the extent of Paul's legs. If he is playing badly hurt, bless hi and let's hope he gets better, not worse.
Monty just needs to know how to avoid these all-too-often meltdowns that we have in the 4th quarter. How many games have we lost or almost lost because of a very poor offensive 4th quarter? Probably too many. He needs to ride the hot hand. Jesus. He and Demps also need to work on getting that big man who can hopefully grab a rebound with his HANDS.
Damn Bulls, i want win against it in march with Emeka! I like all Hornets players and the coach, but i don't understand the rotation in starting minutes of fourth quarter... Don't use a clock Monty, simply understand the game (ok, is possible the fuel is finish?), the enemy run with this system... 0-5 against Bulls in the last five, i want look the pride in Chicago!
Do any of yall truly sit back and realize what you are yelling at people like m-W and I for? Are you really defending Marco Belinelli or JJ as our backup 2 guards or are you just defending the fact that some people don't think Monty Williams is the second coming? Do any of us really say that Monty hasn't done a terrific job this year getting our team to play team defense and to buy into his attitude? Do any of us doubt that he and Dell have squashed the CP3 rumors? For that matter, do any of us doubt that he might have the best chance of any coach in the league of keeping CP3 in a NOLA uniform? NO, NO, and NO. Why do you people get so annoyed? You don't have a rationale. All you do is complain about people complaining about Marcus not getting playing time. THERE IS NEVER REBUTTAL. You don't come back with anything intelligent to say. All you do is complain about us complaining. It's nonsense. At least people like me take the time to calculate Marco's stats since the beginning of December to prove my point. I don't even have to do Jack because he's just plain awful as a whole in a Hornets uniform. So please. PROVE ME WRONG. You can't. Because the fact of the matter is that MT5 is the best SG we have and the only SG who can lay claim otherwise is Willie Green, who actually is having a decent season. As Hornets fans, we have a right to be pissed. Because we've seen this SAME CRAP from Byron Scott for the last 7 years. Yes, maybe Monty gets doubted more because of Byron's ghost but it's there nonetheless. Monty will be 10x the coach the BS was. We all know it. But come on. It's gone too far. We just want the damn kid to play. So provide a counter argument or sit down. Because you're complaints are part of the problem just as much as mine are. There's no such thing as one sided arguments. At least my side isn't just throwing poop at the door to see if it sticks. Congratulations. You have convinced a great majority of people that we are out of line. You played the political game. You, also, have not contributed anything of value to the conversation.
Doghouse: I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. That's Voltaire, and it's a favorite (translated). It's up there with Common Sense is not so Common. At any rate, as long as you aren't calling someone a schizo etc. I like that you are asking for analysis. In fact, I wish you'd provide more, but I know it's tough. Boy howdy, it's tough.
Watching sports on TV, or even far up in the seats, you don't get a really good feel for the confusion that takes place. Having now been lucky enough to see the Hornets once and many, many Bulls games from floor level, I think I am beginning to understand the difficulty of succeeding. There is a mad, confision like battle taking place. Highlt skilled players against equally skilled opponants...and it all becomes a sort of action demanding a reaction causing another reaction....the entire game plan is sort of out the window after the whistle blows after each time out. But unlike our street ball or amature tennis or fun stuff, here we get to blog about the success or failure of the participants. I can see why in many ways, its stupid because we have absolutely no idea what is actually going on, especially behind the scene. We don't know the conversations between coach and players. We don't know that a player is in BUT has only 40 percent of his left knee. Gotta tell you, after watching the Orlando game RIGHT undr the basket on the floor...it was BRUTAL! The hitting, the banging, the trash talking...the refs could have called fouls on every single play or player and very likely been right. And as for Monty, never being a real fan of rookie coaches, I am...however...in favor of stopping the in-breeding of NBA coaches. I get tired of the same old faces showing up as head coaches through the decades. It's like the insane world of business CO's. They get hired to run companies, cause them to fail, get stupid lots on money in umbrella buy outs...THEN GET REHIRED at another company. So I am still rooting for this young coach. Sorry for the long winded way of saying relax. We are getting there. We will get better as the playoffs approach and then the real, and only fight, begins.
ugh, its slowly becoming a trend. Marcus Thornton is the most polarizing member of the Hornets. i'm slowly hating going in this site because every time i read the comment's section, people are angry at each other because of Marcus Thornton. I can't believe people are bashing Monty's intelligence(with regards to playing time), or his integrity(too proud to play Marcus?). Man. It's the YoungFella situation all over again, when i went on a commenting hiatus because everybody was hating on each other. UGH. it sickens me. can everybody just stop fighting?
Nikkoewan, I agree with you. I moderated a comment or two this week and I didn't like it. I will do it again, however.
Ahh the Youngfella situation, this may not be quite there yet but that was terrible... whatever happened to him?
ok here is the thing you all need to understand.. Marcus plays BETTER AT HOME. Season H-R Splits: (18 MIN/GM) Home: 46% FG/45% 3PT/76.3% FT/10.3 PTS/1.2 3s/2.8 REB/0.7 AST/1 TO (14 MIN/GM) Away: 34% FG/20% 3PT/72.7% FT/5 PTS/0.3 3s/2.9 REB/1.2 AST/0.7 TO Now, Monty is playing Marcus more at home than on the road. And this is a trend: October H-R splits:(DNPs NONE) (14:51 MIN/GM) Home:46% FG/66% 3PT/66% FT/9 PTS/0.6 3s/2 REB/0.5 AST/0.5 TO (30 MIN/GM) Away: 34% FG/20% 3PT/72.7% FT/5 PTS/0.3 3s/2.9 REB/1.2 AST/0.7 TO November H-R splits(DNPs 4 home games/3 road games) (15:28 MIN/GM) Home: 58% FG/66% 3PT/8 PTS/1 3s/2.5 REB/0.5 AST/0.5 TO (9:45 MIN/GM) Away: 16% FG/0% 3PT/100% FT/2 PTS/0 3s/1.8 REB/0.6 AST/0.8 TO December H-R splits:(DNPs 0 H/3 R) (18:45 MIN/GM) Home: 50% FG/41% 3PT/71.4% FT/10.8 PTS/1.2 3s/2.6 REB/0.6 AST/0.6 TO (14:45 MIN/GM) Away: 24% FG/0 3PT%/50% FT/4.2 PTS/0.33 3s/3.3 REB/0.8 AST/0.7 TO January H-R splits: (0 H/1 R) (18:58 MIN/GM) Home: 41% FG/47.4% 3PT/88% FT/10.7 PTS/1.3 3s/3.43 REB/1 AST/1 TO (15:11 MIN/GM) Away: 41% FG/20 3PT%/75% FT/7.42 PTS/0.42 3s/3.7 REB/1.9 AST/0.57 TO February H-R splits (0 H/1 R) (19:58 MIN/GM) Home: 40% FG/33% 3PT/66.7% FT/10.3 PTS/1 3s/2.7 REB/0.6 AST/0.6 TO (08:18 MIN/GM) Away: 33% FG/0 3PT%/2 PTS/0 3s/0.5 REB/0.6 AST/0.5 TO See? Monty's taught Marcus to play average to above average defense. Now? He is trying to teach him the value of consistency on the road. Notice that Monty's DNPs are on the road, and when its a home games, he plays him because he knows Buckets is inspired by the home crowd and makes him play better. That's sound coaching right there. If he can show a little consistency on the road, he'll be the 6th man we always wanted. quote me. :) otherwise, we will continue to see this kind of a trend. Plays lots of minutes when its at home and/or he's on fire, or when we have injuries.
Thank you for this nikkoewan. I had just about given up ... You feel like Williams is trying to improve Thornton's (a second year player) overall game and you use William's allotment of Thornton's minutes to show it. I can dig it. Not that your analysis is spot (I mean who knows really but the coach and the player), but I follow your rationale, it's reasonable to me and it's a lot better to read than the "I saw my favorite player score a bunch of points in this one game so he's good but the coach isn't playing him so he must hate my favorite player and be a terrible coach!!" type of commentary I've had to slog through recently. I'm all for debate but much of the conversation I see here looks like petty arguing.
I have no idea why you people are hating on Monty's Doghouse. Marcus Buckets was by far the most efficient scorer tonight for the Bees, and I didn't see one defensive lapse from him tonight. If one of your guys scores 20 in a HALF, he should be the first one off the bench next half. Or at the very least, the guy you rely upon in key fourth quarter minutes, and not just in the last two minutes when the game is over. The Bulls are a horrible team, benefiting from playing in the weak East. Boozer was really the only impressive player they had, but when we couldn't score, they snuck ahead. Memo to Monty: yes, Marcus is the answer, dumbass. But you know what, fuck it, trade him to Dallas, along with Peja and Tyson, two other guys the front office here didn't think could play, but which are KEYING victories in Texas. Use your brain, Monty, and ignore your pride. See what happens.
The game was lost at the boards and free throw line. Marcus Thorton shooting the ball like a hot potato didn't have much to do with it. Separately, the Bulls are in fact a great team with better record than the Hornets in the Western Conference and overall. One undersized shooting guard cannot stop a pack of Bulls. This is a team game, not a solo act. So if you want to root for one guy then do it on marcusthorton247.com not Hornets247. Furthermore, using foul language and making false accusations will not be tolerated. Trolls aren't welcome here.
"The Bulls are a horrible team, benefiting from playing in the weak East." REALLY? They benefit from it yes but they're not a horrible horrible team. They have the best defense by far in the NBA, and have the MVP leader right now. They were well rested, and we weren't. It showed in the 2nd half. I guarantee you, if Marcus plays well in both road games coming up, he's 6th man of the year unless we trade him to get big men which I don't see happening.
I never guaranteed anything before this, but with Marco no longer the starter, it's between Marco and Marcus for the 6th man spot, and if Marco continues to suck like has, Monty will be going to Marcus. I am 100% on that. Monty stuck by Marcus in January even when his shooting sucked btw. He had games where he was 3-10 and he still got 20 minutes.
see, everybody keeps making these "guarantees" like they've got a trick up their sleeve. McNamara has said it and either Joe or Ryan, as well as yourself, Hornet, and many others. Guarantees usually pertaining to MT5. We've seen Marcus play the lights out and then proceed to get crapped on with 8 minutes in the next game. You can't guarantee anything unless you're Monty.
Bulls are 16-7 against the West...Hornets are 16-16. I'd say the Bulls are handling the West just fine and certainly far better than the Hornets.
However, I do agree with your comment on ATH. Play him or trade him. His value is not going to get higher than a showcased game like this. Go get us a REAL backup big or suck it up and stick with him.
Offensive guards are a dime a dozen. How is it we don't have one besides Thornton? Mek, we need you.
Belinelli losing the game? Seriously? That's how coaching works. Beli goes in. Beli does bad. Beli goes out. I don't see anything wrong there. It's not like Monty can see into the future. This stuff is getting past irritating.
To 'Monty'sDoghouse's' point ... Ofcourse Marco didn't lose the game for us tonight, but it is sort of irritating how Monty is trying so hard to stick with him, and in contrast work so hard to keep Marcus off the floor. I don't get that. I'm all for the HOT HAND!!! Marco has been terrible for two months with a good game here-and-there. I like Willie and Marcus at the moment for our 2-guard tandem. Now, if Marco is Ariza's back-up, then I can understand giving him minutes ahead of Pondexter and Palvovic. I will give Monty credit ... he did shorten Marco's leash this game. He took him right out after a few mistakes!!! L_REAZY
RT @gvtalk: In tonight's loss the Hornets missed 41 shots and had 2 off rebs for zero 2nd chance pts. Superb def rebs by Bulls. 6 minutes ago via TweetDeck :?
coach Monty Williams: "We came out like we were champions for some reason in the third quarter." 42 minutes ago via HootSuite :?