Odom Dominates as Lakers hand the Hornets rare Home loss

By:
Published: December 29, 2010

After last night’s loss against San Antonio, some Hornets fans worried whether Kobe would come out with something to prove, but it wasn’t #24 who killed New Orleans tonight, it was their new 6th man- Mr. Khloe Kardashian himself. Lamar scored a game high 24 points in his first game of the season in which he came off the bench.

Phil Jackson gave Andrew Bynum the start, moving Pau Gasol back to power forward, and the length of those two really bothered the Hornets on both ends of the court. The Lakers started the game pounding the ball inside on offense and pushing the Hornets out of the paint when New Orleans had the ball. In the first 15 minutes, the Lakers had 22 points in the paint and that opened up their outside shooting. Before you knew it, the Lakers were up 59-41 at the half and the game was all but over at that point.

The Lakers finished the game shooting 58.6% from the field and were +20 in rebounding margin, as the Hornets finished with a season low 24 boards. The final score might have read 103-88, but the game wasn’t really that close. Once David West went down with an ankle injury in the second quarter, the Hornets were basically a one-man squad and the Lakers simply had too much size and skill. After watching this game, it is hard to fool yourself into thinking this team is one trade away from being a contender (or as some people believe, simply move MT5 to the starting lineup). The Lakers aren’t even close to running on all cylenders and they just beat the Hornets down like they were a pesky (much) younger brother.

Notes and Observations:

– David West left the court in the second quarter and spent the rest of the half in the locker room. He came back in the third and made a few jumpers, but he just wasn’t the same. Since the Hornets were out of it in the fourth, Monty sat West for the remainder of the game. Kevin Garnett went down with an injury today, so hopefully West can play. If not, we might get that Big Baby/J Smitty match-up we all want to see.

– Trevor Ariza: 1-2, 4 points, 4 fouls, 4 turnovers in 24 minutes. You know, Quincy Pondexter hasn’t been looking too bad.

– Good News: Marco Belinelli had 15 points against a good team. Bad news: He took 16 shots and was 1-6 from three, most of which were wide open. The guy just isn’t a starter on a good team. I met the guy a few times, I like him, I wish him the best, but he is a short or a long term answer for this team.

– Chris Paul was ready to go tonight, scoring 10 points in the first ten minutes and playing with great intensity. It is a joke that people put any blame on this guy- EVER. Kobe goes to the bench up 3 points, he returns and his team is up 18. When has CP3 ever had this luxury? He had a nice starting five in 07-08 that stayed relatively healthy and he led the team to 56 wins and only missed out on MVP because it was Kobe’s time after being robbed himself in the past.

Now Paul has one other guy who shows up night in and night out and a bunch of other guys who would have much lesser roles on elite teams. Okafor would be the Lakers 4th big, Marco wouldn’t see the court on Orlando, Ariza is an energy guy off the bench on a good team, Jason Smith wouldn’t get off the bench for any of the contenders out West- I can go on and on. 11-1 was nice and I am glad it happened, but we have to be real about the talent on this team.

– Matt Barnes is a punk. That’s it and that’s all.

– Coach Williams said he expects WIllie Green to play at some point this week, but the team is giving him his space. He has been helping his family through this tragedy and I hope that we can all show him love when he returns to the Hive.

118 comments
L_Reazy
L_Reazy

'JCS' & 'Ziko' (from a previous discussion of "Odom Dominates as Lakers hand the Hornets rare Home loss") I feel what you mean about realistic trades ... but we question trades and why they happen all the time. The reality is if we really knew about trades months before they eventually happened we would say, many of times, "Why would that team want to do that trade?" Point is: we never know why they do what they do! What I do know is each player I included in those trades would fit with there new team. David West & Trevor Ariza would fit in Philadelphia Marco Belinelli would fit in New York Jason Smith would fit in Sacramento Emeka Okafor and Marcus Thornton would fit in Denver Willie Green would fit in Houston Quincy Pondexter would fit in Washington I agree, Jordan Hill and Courtney Lee are young, but they are also just 'Marginal' players; and they definitely are not untouchable. Houston would deal those two players, and Willie Green is actually more solid. McGee makes a lot of mistakes with John Wall and Kirk Hinrich, but would probably become more efficient with Chris Paul the same way Tyson Chandler did. This is partially why JaVale McGee is not untouchable, and being shopped as we ... type! I see your point about Marco Belinelli for Anthony Randolph, and how New York doesn't want to give Chris Paul a reason to stay. However, D'toni would absolutely love a player like Belinelli! I know you'll hate me for this, and I'll probably be on an Island for this next comment, but, I actually prefer J.R. Smith over Marcus Thornton ... yea I know ... to me he's just more explosive. Sorry yawl! Someone mentioned that Jason Thompson is being shopped for a PG, which is true. Nevertheless, he's being shopped! So, I made a pitch for him. One thing is for certain: The Hornets can no longer make Mediocre or 'Marginal' trades and expect to get better or 'ELITE'. 'JCS' I like Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon too, but they can't help us reach our lofty goals. You know that, because you and I have seen the Hornets do trade that way time-after-time, and we often criticized Jeff Bower for doing so. Dell Demps, for all the good things he has done so far cannot afford to make 'Bower-like' mistakes! Let's make some "Blockbuster Deals"! L_REAZY

Davey
Davey

JCS, to respond to your questions, my view is that the difference between the Hornets at their best and the Hornets of this season is personnel. In particular, the impact that healthy Tyson Chandler had. I think Monty has done a solid job. I can pick some nits with him, but the team has more or less played to expectation. I was responding to your comment about a change in focus, or a return to the virtues of Byron Scott...again, for me, the limitations of the Hornets have everything to do with the roster. Their defensive rebounding percentage is second in the NBA, just behind Orlando and just ahead of Boston. I don't have time today to look at their rebounding rate against playoff teams only (feel free to do a closer game-by-game analysis!), but just giving a quick glance at boxscores, it's as you'd expect: they are less effective on the defensive glass against elite offensive rebounding teams such as the Lakers...but other than that, they don't appear to have any particular struggles rebounding against playoff teams. I don't follow your point about height*, but it is the case that the Hornets get defensive rebounds in somewhat unconventional ways, with, for example, Paul and Ariza masking some of West's relatively paltry boardwork for a 4. They're quite bad on the offensive glass. Which is a bummer, because their scoring efficiency is subpar. Again, the team has a number of problems but the biggest issues are on the offensive end of the floor. *Obviously height/length correlates to some extent with effective rebounding, but it's by no means the end-all.

JCS
JCS

Thanks for your explanation of personnel. Every time I read that word I think of the suit-and-ties off the court versus the guys who actually play on the court. As for my point about height, when I saw Lamar and Pau grab rebounds with both feet on the ground as Marcus and Quincy frogged around, I wanted to turn my head and spit. Instead, I've come on here trying to get the point across that it seems like the most successful teams on average, actually have the tallest teams. And so, if the Hornets were to trade for height plus skill, it would make a huge difference down the road IMPO. Lakers have 3 players under 6-6: 15 Ron Artest F 6-7 260 9 Matt Barnes F 6-7 226 5 Steve Blake G 6-3 172 *** 12 Shannon Brown G 6-4 210 *** 24 Kobe Bryant - C G 6-6 205 17 Andrew Bynum C 7-0 45 Derrick Caracter F 6-9 3 Devin Ebanks F 6-9 215 2 Derek Fisher - C G 6-1 210 *** 16 Pau Gasol C 7-0 250 7 Lamar Odom F 6-10 230 50 Theo Ratliff C 6-10 235 1 Joe Smith F-C 6-10 225 4 Luke Walton F 6-8 235 Hornets have 6 players under 6-6: 1 David Andersen C 6-11 247 1 Trevor Ariza F 6-8 210 15 Marcus Banks G 6-2 205*** 8 Marco Belinelli G 6-5 *** 34 Aaron Gray C 7-0 270 33 Willie Green G 6-3 201 *** 28 Didier Ilunga-Mbenga C 7-0 255 2 Jarrett Jack G 6-3 197 *** 44 Pops Mensah-Bonsu F 6-9 235 50 Emeka Okafor C 6-10 255 3 Chris Paul - C G 6-0 175 *** 20 Quincy Pondexter F 6-6 225 14 Jason Smith F-C 7-0 240 5 Marcus Thornton G 6-4 205 *** 30 David West - C F 6-9 240 Spurs have 5 players under 6-6, two of which get playing time. I'll have to check and see what their roster was when they were winning it all.

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

'42' ... give it a chance! TRADE PROPOSAL ... OPERATION: BLOW IT UP DELL; PUT A GOOD PRODUCT OUT THERE. Trade: Jason Smith for Jason Thompson Marco Belinelli for Anthony Randolph Emeka Okafor & Marcus Thornton for J.R. Smith & Chris Andersen David West & Trevor Ariza for Andre Iguadola & Thaddeus Young Willie Green for Courtney Lee & Jordan Hill Keep Marcus Banks' expiring deal and Trade Exception for the offseason ***Every Trade Proposed Does Work Money-Wise*** NEW ROSTER: F- Jason Thompson (David West clone, but more physical & 4th option) F- Andre Igudola (Upgrade over Trevor & 3rd option) C- Javale McGee (Tyson Chandler Clone, Crescent City Connection 2.0) G- J.R. Smith (Go-To-Guy, should've never left, can be a 4th Quarter Closer) G- Chris Paul (Mr. Everything) F- Anthony Randolph (Upgrade over Jason Smith) F- Thaddeus Young (Exceptional Back-up, can play 3 or 4) C- Chris Andersen (Upgrade over current Andersen, should've never left) G- Courtney Lee (Similar game to J. R. Smith, 2nd unit does not lose a 'beat'!) G- Jarret Jack (CP3's friend ... Monty's "son" ... he is solid at times though) F- Jordan Hill (Insurance for Anthony Randolph and Jason Thompson) ***once again, the Hornets still have Marcus Banks' expiring contract and Trade Exception. Your Thoughts .... L_REAZY

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

Aye. I want to give all of you a little piece of advice when it comes to making trades. If you want to give a trade scenario, PRETEND to be a fan of the other organization. Then, think HOW would the trade help you from that end? L_Reazy... Sacramento WILL NOT trade Jason Thompson for Jason Smith. It won't happen dude. First off, they are desperately looking for a PG. They have now offered Jason Thompson for Jeff Teague of Atlanta, and Kyle Lowry of Houston. Neither clubs bit. Also, Westphal wont be coaching there much longer. The guy is absolutely CLUELESS on how to run his team. Istead of establishing a high/low offense to utilize his young and athletic size of Thompson/Landry/Cousins, the guy has tried implementing a fast paced offense, with tons of 1 on 1 isolations with Evans and 1 of the bigs. He also has no understanding of creating defensive rotations. Go back and watch our win against Sac town. We got back into that game because they just dont know what to do when someone goes by their man. NY WILL NOT HELP US. Period. Dude, they want CP to leave. They don't want to give him a reason to stay. And Randolph would give CP a POTENTIAL reason to stay. As for JR Smith and Chris Anderson... I would LOVE to have Anderson back, but no way in hell would I want to watch JR Smith give a pouty face every time Monty subbed him out. The guy has the maturity level of a 15 year old. And like others have mentioned, is basically the same player Marcus Thornton is. And how much time does that guy get? The last 2 you gave are REAL humdingers for me. Green for Courtney Lee and Jordan Hill. WOW. You're basically telling Houston to give you 2 of their young core that they are trying to build with, for an aging, short, back up shooting guard. LoLoLoLoL. I was shocked at this point. But you only made it get better. Philadelphia has announced they are no longer considering offers for Iguodala unless a team is willing to take the expiring contract of Elton Brand as well, or if Carmelo Anthony would consider coming to Philly. But even so, Doug Collins has stated that Iguodala and Brand are the CORE to his team, with Young being his 6th man. And they are a SERIOUS playoff team in the East now, playing VERY good basketball. So why on EARTH would they just give us Iguodala and Young for another PF to clog their rotation (Brand, Young, Speights, Songaila, Brackins). As for Javale McGee. I am a BIG fan of McGee's. Have been since he came into the league. But there is no way in hell Washingtons gonna give him up for Q. To be honest, I think that Washington intends to keep McGee, and is really interested in shipping Blatche and his ego and attitude out of town. But they "say" they are shopping "both" to get teams interested in talking. If a really good offer presents itself, I'm sure they'd consider trading McGee. But you gotta give them a better reason then Pondexter. As much as I LOVED your team. Thats just never gonna happen my friend.

JCS
JCS

@Ziko I agree with you 100%. Reazy's team is EPIC, but I for one did not want comment on the (un)likelihood of it coming to be. Westphal is dumb. Thompson won't go. Thadeus is a pipe dream. And McGee who I want almost more than anyone for this team, is for serious trades* only. Based on my research, I think we can do the following: Trade Marco, Marcus, and Ariza. Dump Gray. Get Jamario Moon, and Anthony Parker from Cleveland, as well as Maurice Evans, and Josh Powell from Atlanta. There's a gang of players I'd prefer, half of which are in Reazy's EPIC team, but I think my aforementioned are more realistic. No disrespect @Reazy.

BeesGivingEffort
BeesGivingEffort

*L_REAZY this is not so much directed at you as the rest* You guys drive me fricking up a wall. You view JR Smith as an upgrade to Marcus Thornton. LOL? JR Smith IS Marcus Thornton with a crappier attitude and less energy and hustle. Simply amazing. You guys will find any excuse to back up Monty Williams regarding Thornton. I'm convinced. This isn't even worth talking about anymore. 42 likes to act uber-intelligent and thoughtful but for some reason when it comes to MT5-Loving or Monty-Hating he throws it out the window.

42
42

I dislike JR Smith nearly as much as I dislike Rudy Fernandez (this is dislike, not an assessment of their ability). I'll entertain the idea out of respect for the package of deals Reazy put together for us. Bees: I can't make you read the things I post where I say many of the same things about Marcus and Monty that you do. I read your posts and respond to what you actually say, dude. Why do you ignore the things I say that agree with you? If you can't show me the respect I've shown you by acknowledging the things I've written that are positive about Marcus on a basically weekly basis, then I really don't know how productive our conversations can be.

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

I agree with Bees in regards to Thornton-JR Smith. But I am indifferent to seeing Marcus start. I don't see him as the Godsend some are making him out to be. He's just a scoring guard. Nothing more. Just like JR Smith. Just a really good back up.

42
42

I'm going to read this carefully because you're effort has earned effort on my part. I'm going to also give a quick impression, since you deserve a quick response for the same reason. I smell what you are cooking, I like it, and I'll spot you the money stuff without checking, but I see issues with getting Thompson. Why would they take Smith? I'm asking, not picking.

42
42

Reazy, Can I call you Reazy? Reazy, I like what you are doing here, but I have to agree with Ziko that there is a problem of `will' on the part of the trading partners. I've been wanting a `hockey enforcer', to use hewhorocks' term for what I called it, and damnit, I can't figure out how to get one. Dude, we should look at every team and pick the guy that has the `feel' you are looking for and figure out how to get them Probably none of them will happen, but I think it'd be a good exercise. Ziko's point about putting yourself in the other team's shoes is a good one. We need to find teams that have a need that we can fill. I made a case for Minnesota being such a team (I can re-post it). Ziko says the Kings need a guard . . . How about sending Green and Gray for some pieces?

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

'42' I've watched a few Kings games and noticed their BIG rotation is Dalembert, Cousins, and Landry. They don't play Jason Thompson consistently anymore with the addition of Cousins. Jason Smith could play those 'SPOT' minutes for the Kings with his expiring contract, and they wouldn't lose a PF who could shoot and rebound some. Jason Thompson has 1-year left ... while playing those 'SPOT' minutes. It almost seems that the Kings have made their minds up and said bye to Dalembert's expiring contract at the end of the year, and they wouldn't mind saying bye to Jason Thompson too in order to get a better fit for the Kings. If the Kings had Jason Smith's expiring deal to go with Dalembert's, maybe they'd feel they could get a better BIG MAN this offseason. That was sort of my 'realistic' thinking behind that trade. Plus, it's not like Jason Smith wouldn't fit in Paul Wesphal's system off the bench. L_REAZY

JCS
JCS

@Reazy I realize this comment wasn't directed at me, but I must say that that team would be epic...Just curious, did you do any research on salary, or know that J.R. and Birdman use to be Hornets? Trading can be very tricky and repeating history even moreso.

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

Yes ... Salaries all match or fit CBA requirements. J.R. Smith has always impressed me, and I feel he has the tools to be a good team defender. Chris Andersen is a Beast and very marketable, and with stiff competition from the Saints, the Hornets need more excitement to go along with being good. When they were 11-1 nobody showed up at the arena. Just look at the athletes on the team I proposed: Andre Iguadola JaVale McGee J.R. Smith Anthony Randolph Thaddeus Young Chris Andersen Courtney Lee MY GOD ... come on ... I mean who wouldn't want to watch this team play? This team would be fun to watch and able to compete with any team in the league, especially with Chris Paul as the leader. GMs should be able to pitch these kinds of trades and 'get-er-done'! L_REAZY

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

OOPS!!!! I FORGOT TO MENTION: Trade: Quincy Pondexter for JaVale McGee ... ...add this to the list above! L_REAZY

Davey
Davey

Rebounding issues on this club are about personnel, not focus (just as the team's peak success had a lot more to do with healthy Tyson Chandler than Byron Scott). In any case, their defensive rebounding rate is actually among the best in the league. The team has more than one problem, but the biggest one is that they're not very efficient at turning possessions into points.

JCS
JCS

So the team peaked b/c of it's players and not b/c of Scott? Fast forward to to today the team is not excelling b/c of Monty as opposed to the players? Just want to make sure I understand your point. Perhaps I don't. Either way, how is their defensive rebounding against playoff teams, namely San Antone and LA? Furthermore, which team has a height advantage and what is their efficiency per height? That is, if Team A has five players on the court with a mean height of 6-7 and Team B has five players on the court with a mean height of 6-4 what are their efficiency ratings and who won the game?

42
42

Mean height doesn't affect rebounding rate strongly. Height is a factor, but where the height is positioned is a bigger factor. Our 7 footers on the bench, or Smith sitting 17 feet from the basket doesn't help us. Shorter guards drag the mean height down, but they are just as capable of getting the long rebounds of the rim since they are way more thinly spread that the concentration of mean under the basket. It's coaches and players, of course. Monty can't make Trevor a better shooter. Monty can, however, involve him properly in the offense, which is getting him enough long balls to make him credible enough to spread the defense a little, and see about getting him the ball on a cut to the basket.

JCS
JCS

This team was at it's peak when Player-Coach Champion Byron Scott led the way. If the Hornets draw from that success (e.g. #2), plus capitalize on their talent (trades or no trades), then they will have much more success down the road.

42
42

True about Byron and the peak, but it was also horrible when he was at the helm when Davis went away, when everyone was hurt, and then declined under him. I think Byron is a good coach and was a necessary component for getting to 56 wins. I do not think he was the only guy who could do this for us, and I do think there was only so much he could do when Tyson was at 75%. Bryon also let the 58-point beat-down happen. Player intensity can account for losing a few points, or even 20, but the other 38 came from the team just folding for a number of reasons. I don't hold what's happening in Cleveland against him. As I said, we were horrible under Bryon to start. Cleveland lost 1 key player and are on pace to win about 1/3 of what they won last year. I like the guy, respect the guy, and I think Byron will be a part of Cleveland becoming a franchise that is in the playoffs regularly again.

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

'42' I think the key is to find scorers who Monty can mold into defenders. If Monty is capable of molding Belinelli into a better defender than he can mold anyone. If Chris Paul is considered to be our 'Closer' like Kobe, LeBron, D-Wade, Melo, and Kevin Durant-chula, then that's fine. However, is he a closer? Is that his role in the 4th quarter even as an outstanding playmaker? I say no! The Hornets have been trying for years to turn David West into that 'Closer' in the 4th Quarter, but he is not a closer ... just a very good scorer on most nights from Quarters 1-3. Similar to Michael Beasley and the T-Wolves. Their in every game, but can never close out the opposition in the 4th Quarter. They just need a 'Closer', and I've seen this for years as a resident of Minnesota. The Hornets need a 'Closer' to take the pressure off CP3. Obviously, the "Real Closers" that I mentioned are unavailable. So, Demps should try and find a player who could be a 'Closer'. For example, when Manu Ginobli came into the league we all thought he was just a fantastic player, but now we're realizing that he is a fantastic player and a 4th Quarter Closer. He was definitely under the radar in that regard. Just like that Western Conference T-Wolves team against the Lakers years ago, Sam Cassell was the team's 'surprise closer', and when he was unavailable for that series the T-Wolves had no Closer, and had to rely on Troy Hudson. It wasn't in Kevin Garnett's nature to be a Closer , and Latrell Sprewell was too streaky at times. Sam Cassell was money in the 4th Quarter that year for the 'Puppies'. Mr. Big Shot Chauncey Billups did it for the Pistons. So, (1) Scorer that has untapped defender qualities, (2) a 4th Quarter 'Closer', and what did I miss ... oh yea ... "Real Size"! 6-11 and UP! A couple of good, fundamentally sound Big Guys! Lastly, 2-lock down defenders on the perimeter. So, (1) Scorer that has untapped defender qualities (2) a 4th Quarter 'Closer' (3) Real Size in the Paint / fundamentally sound Big Guys (4) 2-lock down defenders on the perimeter I'll give the trade proposal some thought, and return with ideas. L_REAZY

JCS
JCS

A new year is approaching and I think it's time we make some changes: 1a. Trade Marco, Marcus, and Ariza. Dump Gray. 1b. Get Jamario Moon, and Anthony Parker from Cleveland, as well as Maurice Evans, and Josh Powell from Atlanta. 2. Put more focus on shooting inside the paint as well defensive rebounding. 3. Play to win every quarter, even it means setting up a play with 3 seconds on the clock and we're up by 6. Just do it.

42
42

All good ideas. I'll add swap Gray for a 3 that's not getting any minutes. Should be easy.

paul
paul

PLEASE do this. I am a Gray fan ever since his Chi town days. I beg to set him free. Banning him to pergatory pisses me off. PLEASE trade him!

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

No matter how many times you stir $h!T ... it'll never taste as good as chocolate!!!! It might look like chocolate eventually ... but it ain't and never will be chocolate. .....just a lil' something for you Hornets fans / chocolate lovers!!! L_REAZY

42
42

Good job. I'm glad you learned that today. Let's all applaud Reazy, everyone. For some, such feats take a lifetime, and we should not judge harshly those for whom that is true. Let's us set an example here and praise our special guy, Reazy!

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

It was a metaphor for our Hornets! lol! You know, the same old .... aw never mind. L_REAZY

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

Um. Not sure how to respond to this. What kind of chocolate are you talking about?

L_Reazy
L_Reazy

TRADE EVERYBODY ... EXCEPT CP3! BLOW IT UP .... AND THIS TIME GET REAL TALENT IN NEW ORLEANS OR WE WILL EVENTUALLY BE THE "LAS VEGAS HORNETS" OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT! NO ONE WANTS TO WATCH THIS CRAP ON THE FLOOR ANYMORE. I FEEL BAD FOR CP3. WHO CAN REALLY CRITICIZE HIM FOR DEMANDING A TRADE? IT AIN'T LIKE LEBRON AND CARMELLO WHO ACTUALLY HAD/HAVE TALENT AROUND THEM IN CLEAVLAND AND DENVER. L_REAZY

42
42

Let's see your trade proposals. I'm ready to get better.

bobby chi
bobby chi

Would Ron Artest do better than Ariza on our team..?

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

Yea. I can't wait to hear this.

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

This is a completely separate opinion from what everyone has talked about. I keep hearing that Marcus Thornton should be the guy starting in place of Marco Belinelli. I just don't see how that makes us better. I really like Marcus's energy off the bench. He can be our Jason Terry if he can learn to play defense. But I have a differing opinion as to who should start at the 2 for us, and I know it's a little out there. When we made the trade for Jarrett Jack, I was VERY confused as to why we traded for a STARTING PG, and were trying to give him 10-15 minutes a game. It just wasn't making sense to me. Jack is a STARTING PG in this league. I KNOW he is. Last night he played 14 minutes. This is a guy who was playing 30+ in Toronto and averging 10+ points a game. I honestly think HE should be the one to start. And here's why: 1. He's a veteran. 2. He's a ball handler who can take pressure off of CP. 3. He is more of a scoring PG anyway. 4. He would make us MUCH faster on the court. 5. Even though he's 6'3 like Marcus and Willie, he's the better defender of the 3 and can full court press guards with Paul. 6. He plays well NEXT to Paul (4th quarter vs. Atlanta) 7. Our starters are already small. Why not speed up the tempo and attack more? 8. When 1 subs out, the other plays primary PG. 9. It'll allow CP to look to score more. 10. It's a change. And probably the smartest one we can make. A lot of you are screaming start Thornton. I just don't see him as a starter. He fires away every chance he gets. When we were winning, it was because we played TEAM BALL. We need to keep the TEAM BALL mentality. The more I think about it, the more I think that if we are going to make an internal change, starting Jack would be the most ideal one we could make. No. He can't guard guys like Kobe Bryant. But NO ONE can. Instead, I'd think about it from the offensive end, and forcing Kobe to guard either Jack or Paul, 2 guys who will attack the heck out of you, and FORCE YOU to play defense. Chris Paul has been our most consistent 3 point shooter. Well, why not plug someone who can GET HIM THE BALL in position to shoot?

42
42

Ziko: You think, and that makes me think. Regardless of what people say about this, thanks for the thinking. I've got no issue with Jack starting. I've got no issue with Marco starting. I've got no issue with Marcus starting. It's about matchups. I don't care about the first 6 minutes . . . just get the next 42 right . . .

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

Really Bees? I guess Chris Paul doesn't know what he's talking about either, right? I took the that line from him in his last interview he was asked about Jack.

BeesGivingEffort
BeesGivingEffort

"Jack is a starter for 20 out of 30 teams in the league" Congratz. You finally proved that you really don't know what you're talking about. At all. BTW, don't act like you didn't bring any of the hostility on yourself when you went around telling every single person that disagreed with you that they don't understand basketball and you do.

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

I agree 42. It works on a 48 minute basis. Which is why I was thinking about it from a distributive standpoint. People have complained about Marcus not getting enough time. I feel like the same can be said for Jack. Think about it... Jack is a starter for 20 out of 30 NBA teams. The same cannot be said for Thornton or Marco. And Jack is playing such miniscule minutes... FOURTEEN minutes last night in a blowout loss. I think from the teams standpoint, he is our best option to start at the 2. He will bring us the veteran leadership we need, especially if he starts playing 30 minutes a night. After him, you can place Green, Thornton, and Marco right behind CP, Jack, and Ariza. In regards to minutes, it would actually balance things out for Monty more too.

BeesGivingEffort
BeesGivingEffort

@Ziko - I'd like to add that I agree with you about the team play on offense. I just think that the mental problems go hand in hand with the problems that you are suggesting. The way I see it. We have 2.75 guys in our starting lineup that look completely lost on offense right now. Chris and David's 2 man game seems to have been affected by trying to force the others into getting involved.

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

Again, another reason I think starting and playing a veteran like Jack would help the team out more so than other current options will.

BeesGivingEffort
BeesGivingEffort

We were winning when our team actually had some semblance of confidence. I think our team's problems are more mental than anything. That is the main reason I want to see Marcus start. I honestly believe of anyone on the team he is the one guy that can bring swagger back to the starting lineup. I think Jarrett would actually be my second choice at starting SG, but I think that move could come off a little desperate and I don't know if that'd help our psyche much.

42
42

Bees: Disagree with me all you want (which is fine) but don't misunderstand me (which is not fine). I am a Marcus fan, I've wanted him to play since the opening night tip, I cheer at home and at the Arena for him, and I think he's going to help the team in one way or another. I'm not sure how you missed this. I point his good and bad, just like I do with the bee closest to my bonnet, D West. This doesn't detract from my fandom for either. C'mon, man, keep the talk about the guys getting checks from the teams, not about us.

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

P.S. I NEVER wrote the kid off. I have said consistently, he is our BEST trading chip behind CP and DWest (thats a serious compliment). And I WANT him to play, I just think he REALLY needs to work on his defense because his footwork is TERRIBLE.

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

Aye, Bees. He's just EMPTY POINTS. If he's SOOO good, then how come we only won 37 games last season? As exciting as he was, WHY DID THAT NOT ACCOUNT FOR MORE WINS. Him and Darren Collison put up great numbers, but we weren't able to break .500. I knew we wouldn't make playoffs when CP went down. But how did we not even break .500 if you think Marcus is THAT good? You just compared him to JR Smith yourself. What is JR Smith? A lifelong VERY GOOD back up shooting guard. Last night Marcus played 17 minutes and managed to jack up ELEVEN shots, only made 2 of them for 5 total points, and OTHER THAN 1 TURNOVER AND 1 FOUL didn't contribute AT ALL TO ANY OTHER STAT CATEGORY TO HELP HIS TEAM. Get your head out of Marcus's a** and open your eyes to the real world. I've said consistently, I think Marco and Marcus are both SOLID guys to have off the bench, but that we need a BETTER, more VETERAN of a starter at the shooting guard position.

BeesGivingEffort
BeesGivingEffort

Yeah, you're right. There is 0% chance that Marcus Thornton getting consistent time with CP3 and David West on the court will make us better. Wow. You and 42 deserve each other. Downright amazing to just write the kid off. You act like Jarrett Jack hasn't been struggling. Jarrett is shooting 34% as a Hornet this year and 24% from three. Don't even try to give me the playing time excuse. Guess who's had to deal with inconsistent playing time. Yeah...

AgentZiko
AgentZiko

Marcus Thornton won't make us better. You're just plugging in another struggling player. You did watch the game last night, right? The game before? The game before that?

QueenBee
QueenBee

"Forget about last night’s game for a second. The Lakers are a championship calibur team, and the Hornets aren’t. We all knew this team wouldn’t contend this year." So what the Lakers are a championship team and the Hornets aren't. It doesn't mean they can't lose a game to the Hornets. The Hornets beat em last year and they still went on to win the championship. So we shouldn't EVER expect to beat these guys just because they are a championship team? Why should we even play them then? Should Monty just rest the starters whenever we play the Lakers because we have no chance of winning anyway? Let the bench guys get all of the burn? I hope the players don't have the thinking that the fans do. Thinking, Oh well, they are a championship team and we aren't so we can't beat them, let's just lay down for them. :? Just because the Hornets aren't going to 'contend' this year doesn't mean they don't need to win games like these.

Mikey
Mikey

Forget about last night's game for a second. The Lakers are a championship calibur team, and the Hornets aren't. We all knew this team wouldn't contend this year. We also all knew that the biggest weakness on this team would be on the glass, well that certainly reared its ugly head last night. Were the refs horrible last night, yes, but the refs didn't cause the Lakers to shoot almost 70% and out-rebound the Hornets by 2 touchdowns and a 2pt conversion in the 1st half. Here is what I want to know going forward, becasuse I think last night's defensive effort was a abboration: 1. Where do the Hornets rank in 3pt defense this season? 2. Where do the Hornets rank in 3pt attempts this season? ...and finally; 3. Where do the Hornets rank in 3pt % this season? My guess is that #s 1 and 3 are really low, and #2 is close to, if not just below, league average. I'm going to assume that, since Peja was traded, this team has gone in the toilet in 3pt percentage. If that's the case, I believe there are multiple factors are at play, 1. Chris Paul doesn't shoot enough 3's; he is the best 3pt shooter on this club currently. 2. Marcus Thornton's 3pt shot selection could use some improvement. 3. Marco and Ariza both need a hug; they are mired in a terrible slump. These combined factors make it extremely tough to run your offense, because you can't space the floor like you want to. Opposing teams just don't respect your ability to knock down shots, so you see West get triple-teamed in the 2nd half of games, and the offense grinds to a screeching halt. Defesively, the Hornets like to protect the paint at all costs (even though they didn't show it at all against the Lakers). That means they are willing to give up 3's, and they have since the beginning of December. You can see that teams are game-planning and scheming on how to get open shots from behind the arc. Check; your move, Monty.

Davey
Davey

No need to guess on that: we're 18th in 3pt. %, 26th in 3pt. attempts, and we're 7th in opponents 3 pt. %. Paul shooting more 3s and Ariza shooting less 3s would be a good thing, assuming we can accomplish that within the flow of the offense.

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